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Izno
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Joined: 27 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 9:46 am Reply with quoteBack to top

1.if u make a custom campaign with a training mission, that only exists to start the cvars which would control all things on the maps that only need to happen once, would it then be possible to use goto mission and back without the bug?
2.is it possible to make a npc eat/use a consumable/stimpack/enhancer?if so, how?
3.is there a .Spr editor?btw i noticed in the game files that they were intending to ship a spr and til editor too...sniff...why couldnt they have just added that, along with all the other features that are broken icon_razz
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requiem_for_a_starfury
Hero of the Wastes
Hero of the Wastes


Joined: 29 Oct 2002
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 11:54 am Reply with quoteBack to top

1. Which bug is that?

2. Not really, if they have one equipped they use it before attacking if hostile. Which can be funny as I have a SM that keeps knocking itself out and is hilarious to watch.

3. There's a fan made editor called Spray, if DaC don't have it you can download it from NMA. It only can handle inventory, door and scenary sprites and you'll need photoshop (which can produce .raw and .act files) to be able to make new sprites.
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Izno
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Joined: 27 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 1:28 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

The bug that occurs when you use Goto mission in map A to go to map B and then use Goto mission in map B to go to map A, the ai will load a fresh map from core instead of the savegame one?or so i've read.so stuff gets reset...
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requiem_for_a_starfury
Hero of the Wastes
Hero of the Wastes


Joined: 29 Oct 2002
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 2:12 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

The reseting of the first map of a campaign occurs if you create a campaign from scratch, the way round it is to open the existing bos.cam and import a new image and data and save it under a new file name, then you won't get the reset but you will probably have to revisit via the worldmap.

I vaguely remember getting a feedback loop when returning to a visited map using the go to command. It didn't reset things, just kept loading maps going from one to another so you couldn't do anything. So the answer is probably no, you wouldn't be able to return via the go to command.
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Retlaw83
Goatse Messiah
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Joined: 17 Jul 2004
Posts: 5327

PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 2:14 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Izno wrote:
The bug that occurs when you use Goto mission in map A to go to map B and then use Goto mission in map B to go to map A, the ai will load a fresh map from core instead of the savegame one?or so i've read.so stuff gets reset...


This bug is a result of making a new cam file. In order to avoid it, make your cam file by modifying bos.cam and naming your new version whatever you want.
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Izno
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 2:35 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

just change the name of bos.cam?and what data to import you mean tables.txt and generic_mission.txt and all of those?i'm gonna 'try' to make a nice rpg like campaign thats set right after FO:T and in the same area so i wouldnt need to change the image.could it cause a problem if i dont?
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Retlaw83
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 3:06 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

You can put whatever information you want into the cam file based off of bos.cam.
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Izno
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Joined: 27 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 3:27 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

ah yes i see, ok by now ive done some more experimenting and i have some more questions :
1.If you use speech occurred, this is only activated once?so you cant use 2 different triggers where the same speech event is a condition?
2.I've tried setting some of the lines of the speech nodes to give a different event, but does this work?can a single speech node contain more events?i think so, so my script was definitely wrong.
anyway most important is 'speech occured' is it like a var thats always true or false or does it just activate once and then do nothing?hmm...i think my script was just way out of whack.because otherwise speech occured worked as a true/false thing, when i tested it alone.so how exactly does it work?
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requiem_for_a_starfury
Hero of the Wastes
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Joined: 29 Oct 2002
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:09 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

All the info in the cam file comes from the campaign.txt in core\tables. Whenever you edit that you need to import the data back into the cam file so the changes will appear in a new campaign. You don't have to change the image, and you don't have import the whole of the campaign text file, just the bits you've changed, i.e. import prefabs or import quartermasters items.

If you want to make an rpg you're using the wrong tools. The FO2 mapper is the one you want. All credit to the people who try and make FOT more than it is, but now the FO2 mapper has been released using FOT Tools to make an rpg is like using a spoon to dig a grave.

Speech events only fire the once, while in essence they are yes/no or true/false statements if you like, they are switches which once turned on can't be turned off.
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Izno
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 4:26 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I will dig damnit!with a wooden spoon if i have to.although the more i try to do the more limitations i find...Still, i will keep digging.btw, about the speech only firing once, i think when i tested it first what i did was unequip the note and re equip it, i think that made the speech fire again after the first time.could be i just used it alone, so the condition and actions of that script were always true.will dig now.
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requiem_for_a_starfury
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 5:18 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

While it's admirable to try to add more depth to a rather poor specimen of a squad based tactical combat game (to make up for a lack of tactical options) it's pointless and kind of silly to try and remould the game into something it's not. At least without the source code that is.

You've got as much chance, if not more, of making FOT the RTS mod than FOT the RPG mod.

The best results with FOT are to accept it for what it is otherwise go and download the FO2 Mapper.

Izno wrote:
btw, about the speech only firing once, i think when i tested it first what i did was unequip the note and re equip it, i think that made the speech fire again after the first time.could be i just used it alone, so the condition and actions of that script were always true.will dig now.
You need to have a trigger that reassigns the click speech if you want to reuse a speech event, it's not like a variable or object script state that can be turned on or off. So if you have a preserved trigger that sets the npc's click speech if you've got a certain item equipped then it'll keep firing (assuming the trigger fired by the speech event is preserved as well) every time you click on the npc with the item equipped. Without the trigger you can keep clicking on someone and the text window will keep coming up but the speech event won't after the first time.
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Izno
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 6:43 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

actually i also use a var to start it, which starts at 'f', so as soon as you equip the 'say hi' note it goes to 't', and another trigger if the var is 't', to change the clickspeech to the one needed and put the var back to 'f', then trigger for if the var is 'f' and you have 0 'say hi' notes equipped to change clickspeech back to none.works fine like this, but they all work fine alone.its finding a way to get them to work together thats puzzling me.i rather not have to use speechevent, because the "say hi" loop thing works without them. but if i did would the following work for resetting it? : condition : speechevent x occurred.
action : whatever you need; set player click speeches to none;B wait 1 seconds; set player speeches 'back to what they were before the event' - Preserved
Also for something random i could then just use the speechevents, giving 3 lines of a node 1 event, and 3 lines of a node some other event.i gonna go try more now and if i get stuck i'll be glad to write alot more questions.Btw, i was more interested in having the main char rpging through the game, but rank in brotherhood or something would determine the size of an army you could use to ie capture cities, exterminate raider camps, etc.So Fot Rpg-Rts smile doesnt change my chances too much i'm shure.
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requiem_for_a_starfury
Hero of the Wastes
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2005 7:06 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

For weapons equipped I just have the items equipped tagged triggers to turn click speech on and off. For you, for multiple conversations, what you need is a trigger that has as it conditions that you need item one & two equipped, then have the click speech set using the variable as the condition.

Otherwise if you have seperate triggers for different notes the second one you equip is overwriting the first.
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Izno
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 11:59 am Reply with quoteBack to top

well the notes work..so far.i use a trigger that when you have no notes at all equiped, npcs affected get their clickspeech set back to none, if i use a diff one for each, like when i dont have a 'say hi', to turn it all to none, then it cancels out any others.it doesnt matter because if i a)put it away and have none equipped, they're set to none, b)if i take another one it should overwrite the one im holding like you said, c)if i put it another note in the second slot, yet another node should be used.now my question, if i equip 2 like that, will the trigger set to fire when i have both, overwrite the ones for them separately?and then, when i put one in inv, will it change the node to the one for the note i still have equipped?i _really_ hope it does.
ive thought some on this and i think it works like this : if u equip one, it fires the trigger for it, and its a one-time i think?.it only fires once, but its re-useable(*thanks the brahmin god*)so the way i think it will actually work the way i hope it will.=>testing
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Izno
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 12:36 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

ok so it didnt exactly work like that it didnt overwrite the first note with the second but i came up with this ; if i have 'say hi' note equipped, it turns all npcs click speech to none, then to the reply.same for the other note.this way, they definitely overwrite eachother, cuz theyr constantly rewritten.now i gonna see what i can do with them together and how that'll affect it.
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requiem_for_a_starfury
Hero of the Wastes
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Joined: 29 Oct 2002
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 2:24 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Again I'm finding your posts intelligable.

Basically If I get this right you have triggers A & B,

Trigger A is fired if you have note A equipped, and it turns variable A on, which in turn sets the click speech to speech node A.

Trigger B is fired if you have note B equipped and it turns variable B on, which in turn sets click speech to speech node B.

So if you equip note A first it sets the click speech to node A, then you equip note B which changes the click speech to node B.

Only trouble is you've got the triggers preserved, so you can re-use the same notes, so they are probably firing continously, I can see you getting a major conflict there, the game wouldn't know which speech node to use and is probably flicking back and forth between them.

What you need is another variable, call it C. This fires if you have both notes A & B equipped. Then you need to add another condition to A and B.

Example

Condition
Human has more than 0 items tagged NoteA equipped.
variable C is false
Action
Set variable A is true.

and the same for Trigger B.

Trouble is the more notes you have the more variants you need to script for.

You need several sets of triggers to turn on variable C. If you've got 6 notes, 3 attitudes and 3 queries you need a trigger to turn on variable c for every combination.

Not to mention the triggers needed to turn on another set of speech nodes for each combination.
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Izno
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 3:09 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

actually i did that first with the vars, but found out if i simply use that last way i found, setting clickspeech to none, and immediately after set it to the one needed, it all works perfectly without any vars.even when ihave 2 equipped they get the 3rd node, then put one back in inv, i get the node for the one i still got equipped.gonna try to put some vars in in the way you described but to trigger other stuff.like this i could use notes labelled "look pissed", "look indifferent", and "look happy" together with any others, which could each trigger different nodes without even 1 var.then in the game if i talked to some BOS guard and i looked pissed he would waste me or something.and if i looked pissed at a citizen or tribal they would flee.and if i looked pissed and said hi to a citizen or tribal they would react frightened.and so on and so forth.:)the only reason i'd need vars now if i needed it to become more complicated, with the reputation perhaps.like player can only talk to certain people if he has certain rank, or rep, or exp.otherwise they could refer him to their second in command, or simply tell the player to bug off.same with some other note im working on, one that asks about an assassination job, but i'd only want the player to get it when he's already said certain stuff.this is hard.after that, setting up a random assassination mission on a citizen or something is easy.
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requiem_for_a_starfury
Hero of the Wastes
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 5:56 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Please please please, use some grammatical structure in your posts. It's not a chat room you can take as much time as you like when typing your post. Even if English isn't your native language, the concept of spaces between sentances, Capitalization and paragraphs can't be too hard to grasp surely?
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Izno
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 6:16 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

I know, sorry but I usually have alot to say smile .So far, everything works fine, except for making people flee when the 'look pissed' note is used, but speecheventoccurred condition would probably do it.Now i'm gonna write more of the speech nodes, because obviously, there need to be alot of them written.its more work then the scripting , but it looks good in the game.
Also a question, is it possible to replace missions/cities in the campaign map during the game?like with a cvar that would trigger on one map, would cause a mission to disappear, and another to appear in its place.If this is possible, i could 'nuke' a city, replacing it with another version that looks a little like it, has alot of radiation around, and only ghouls in it.
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requiem_for_a_starfury
Hero of the Wastes
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2005 8:38 pm Reply with quoteBack to top

Izno wrote:
I know, sorry but I usually have alot to say smile
It's even more important when you have a lot to say, damn I had to read that three times before I could make head or tails of it, and I'm still not too sure what you said.

Izno wrote:
Also a question, is it possible to replace missions/cities in the campaign map during the game?like with a cvar that would trigger on one map, would cause a mission to disappear, and another to appear in its place.If this is possible, i could 'nuke' a city, replacing it with another version that looks a little like it, has alot of radiation around, and only ghouls in it.
You can turn missions, on and off, it's the Set mission state command. Setting the state to covered will hide it, though IIRC the mission name will still show in the list on the worldmap, but it won't be clickable. You might also need to use the mission complete trigger, but my memory is a little hazy on that one.

You can also, if you don't want ghost missions on the worldmap, use the revisit spawnpoint or a campaign variable to move the singleplayer spawn to a waypoint. I was thinking of building a two tier map, it's forced to start at night and one level is a farmer's hut intact, and built above that is a copy of the map but with the farm destroyed. The singleplayer spawn would be placed on the lower map and the spawn revist on the upper level, so first time you visit all is well, but the next time and for all future visits you find the farm destroyed.

Moving the singleplayer spawn via waypoints allows you to start on different parts of the map depending on your actions in earlier missions.

Though I'm not sure how that would play, multi-level maps can get a bit slow sometimes.

Using the Set Mission State is probably better, with several copies of the map, when you want the alternate version to show up set the state to visited, otherwise if you use uncovered the name will revert to unknown, IIRC.
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