"Good RPGs"

[Manoil]

Paper Mario

Gay Nigga Kenobi

[hoochimama]

Another example of a metagame was lockpicking in the Thief series, as opposed to just clicking the use botton a la Oblivion.

Don't you mean Morrowind?

[Kjutte]

Another example of a metagame was lockpicking in the Thief series, as opposed to just clicking the use botton a la Oblivion.

Don't you mean Morrowind?

Personally I loved Morrowind, but Oblivion was a huge letdown.
Well, I liked Oblivion too, but it was nothing compared to the mysticism of Morrowind. I will probably get some hate for saying this, eh?

[Mismatch]

rapelay

I think that's what its called anyways... rilly neat

[jetbaby]

"Good RPGs"

Lol.

[Yonmanc]

Paper Mario

[Gimp Mask]

An important element for me which hasn't really been brought up before is the availability of metagames, or so to say, games inside the game. The best example of this is the technology tree in Arcanum. Getting schematics was just fucking awesome, quite frankly I never liked the game itself so much but I replayed it many times just for how the technology worked. That also led to another factor, items actually mattered. You didn't pick up garbage, only to sell it for 2 bottle caps later on, because you could use a lot of that stuff to make useful stuff, like bullets. Really made it worth checking the contents of every single container.

haha, i thought it seemed mind-numbingly boring plus i couldn't be bothered going through piles of crap and carrying junk around "just in case". different floats for different boats and all that

arcanum and torment are the only crpg's besides fallouts that i've beat, i tried baldur's gate but got bored rolling the dice, nwn was incredibly dull even for a dungeon slasher, i tried kotor and such but they seemed more like progressquest than an rpg, and i never even tried avernumb crap because it's indie swell guy homo swell guy i think. recommendations?

[St. Toxic]

Dink Smallwood. I mean, Paper Mario.

[Manoil]

Good save

And Frater, on the topic of minigames, FO:NV would benefit from having in-game poker where you can bet caps and items. Luck stat and gambling skill (should they choose to include it this time) would affect the hands you are dealt, and if you win too much of your opponent's money, they later attempt to kill you.

Or you could play horseshoes... though that's boring as fuck... and have your STR affect the ease in which you throw. Maxed out strength = make each toss without difficulty.

Boxing/HTH combat minigames for money could also be fun if done right, also depending on your STR for damage dealt and END for how much you can take. Could also prep you in the occasion they have an interesting plot point where you're captured by muties and have to win a HTH brawl with a leader for your freedom-- though I may be getting ahead of myself with the hope of "interesting plot points."

Either way Frater, if Fable's pub games are anything of an example, I would say you're spot-on with the definite benefit of including minigames.

[hoochimama]

arcanum and torment are the only crpg's besides fallouts that i've beat, i tried baldur's gate but got bored rolling the dice, nwn was incredibly dull even for a dungeon slasher, i tried kotor and such but they seemed more like progressquest than an rpg, and i never even tried avernumb crap because it's indie flower homo flower i think. recommendations?

VTM: Bloodlines? Good but sudden drop in content quality near the last 1/4 of the game, be sure to patch.

NWN2:MOTB is pretty fun but the tech/engine is an unwieldy pain, no worse than nwn1 however and you gave that a shot.

[Yonmanc]

I don't mind Fable 2 tbh, it's good at what it does.

[jimmypneumatic]

I played Planescape: Torment a year or two after it's release, it was in the discount bin packaged along with Soulbringer (which I never played).

Even though the setting was based in AD&D, it had the least to do with LotR. PS:T is a good example of engrossing storytelling in a crpg. The story was fresh, due mostly to the creative setting, and takes a few turns I didn't expect. True, the only upgrade is from your starting weapon (a plain scalpel) to an enigmatic dagger that plays a big role in the fate of the planescape much later. But throughout, you're too busy reading into the intricate details of a quest or pondering the morals associated with your decisions to notice the lack of any A to B armor or weapon upgrades.

I'd probably reinstall it on my computer if i knew where the disc was, even though it seemed to me like a game you'd only play through once.

[Gimp Mask]

I'd probably reinstall it on my computer if i knew where the disc was, even though it seemed to me like a game you'd only play through once.

just isohunt the sucker (since you own it anyway, piracy is rydin with hitler blabla) and replay it with the hi res patch?

VTM: Bloodlines? Good but sudden drop in content quality near the last 1/4 of the game, be sure to patch.

hm, i had a crappy computer when it came out, maybe i could give it a shot now. perhaps.

[Amis]

Paper Mario

qfe

[Frater Perdurabo]

An important element for me which hasn't really been brought up before is the availability of metagames, or so to say, games inside the game. The best example of this is the technology tree in Arcanum. Getting schematics was just fucking awesome, quite frankly I never liked the game itself so much but I replayed it many times just for how the technology worked. That also led to another factor, items actually mattered. You didn't pick up garbage, only to sell it for 2 bottle caps later on, because you could use a lot of that stuff to make useful stuff, like bullets. Really made it worth checking the contents of every single container.

haha, i thought it seemed mind-numbingly boring plus i couldn't be bothered going through piles of crap and carrying junk around "just in case". different floats for different boats and all that

arcanum and torment are the only crpg's besides fallouts that i've beat, i tried baldur's gate but got bored rolling the dice, nwn was incredibly dull even for a dungeon slasher, i tried kotor and such but they seemed more like progressquest than an rpg, and i never even tried avernumb crap because it's indie flower homo flower i think. recommendations?

As suggested beforehand VTM:B is great, get the fan made patch, it's a sort of killap's equivalent for the game.

Another game that DaCers insist on not playing but is an instant classic is The Pandora Directive.
I made a thread about it a couple of years ago here:
http://www.duckandcover.cx/forums/viewtopic.php?t=15817

It is 6 CDs and some of the best fun I've ever had with my computer. Under a Killing Moon (the predecessor) and Overseer (the followup) aren't as great in my opinion, but the Pandora Directive is a must play. Acquire it now.

I've just checked, it's available on GOG:
http://www.gog.com/en/gamecard/tex_murp ... _directive

If you acquire it in other means, I mean ebay etc obviously no torrenting and it's a bitch to get working then consult this:
http://www.unofficialtexmurphy.com/mess ... f=3&t=2775

[Kjutte]

arcanum and torment are the only crpg's besides fallouts that i've beat, i tried baldur's gate but got bored rolling the dice, nwn was incredibly dull even for a dungeon slasher, i tried kotor and such but they seemed more like progressquest than an rpg, and i never even tried avernumb crap because it's indie flower homo flower i think. recommendations?

VTM: Bloodlines? Good but sudden drop in content quality near the last 1/4 of the game, be sure to patch.

NWN2:MOTB is pretty fun but the tech/engine is an unwieldy pain, no worse than nwn1 however and you gave that a shot.

NWN2 was a downer for me, but I guess I'll take your word and try MoTB.